Simon Walker interviews Robert Muldoon, TVNZ, 1975
Infamous head-to-head interview that established the raw, combative style of political debate that typified the Muldoon style. Noteworthy also for the time-honoured propaganda technique of "Reds under the bed" as a political image of the tough guy looking after our nation's safety and well-being during the Cold War.The fact that the manoeuvres of the Soviet Navy were totally unassociated with NZ's territorial waters, and further were partially fabricated, were of little consequence. When truth gets in the way of propaganda, propaganda generally wins. Muldoon, an extremely canny politician, picked up early on in his career that the medium of television was ideal for expressing an image, and when the image was widely understood, truth and propaganda were arbitrarily fudged.
SW: "Would you not agree that it was a matter for concern, if you had shown a picture of an Echo-1 submarine and ascribed to it the powers of an Echo-2 submarine?'
RM: "Oh it might be a matter of concern to a "Nit-Picker". Now, how about giving me your fourth question? You ask me …"
SW: "Prime Minister, I'm not going to give questions to your dictation. I should like to ask you now: "Is there anything to suggest that any of these Soviet missiles are aimed at us?"
RM: "How about the fourth question, where you question whether the "Rapucha" landing ship was in fact Russian."
SW: "Prime Minister, I must ask …"
RM: "That was the question …"
SW: "… to be allowed to ask questions in my own time."
RM: "No, no, no, no. You can't because you gave me, one the questions you wanted to ask me, very kindly…"
SW: "Prime Minister, I gave you some facts that we could conceivably challenge …"
RM: "Very kindly. And now you're not answering them, because you found out that they're incorrect."
SW: "I should now like to ask you if there is anything to suggest that these missiles are aimed at us?"
RM: "None whatsoever. The producer of this programme told me today that he would give me the questions that would be asked so that I could confer with defence intelligence sources and give correct answers for the benefit of the people of this country."
SW: "Prime Minister, I regret that we have run out of time.
RM: "I will not, I will not have some smart-alec interviewer changing the rules of the game half way through, Mr Walker. Now…"
SW: "Prime Minister. I regret that we have now run out of time. Nevertheless, thank you for your interview."
Discussion Points:
- "Nit-picker", "smart-alec": Muldoon isn’t adverse to using colloquial language to criticise his opponent.
- Muldoon is insistent on adhering to the questions he claims he was given earlier. He wants to do this "for the benefit of the country." The question of national security during the Cold War period was of utmost importance and Muldoon plays nicely upon this idea.
- Note the close-up shot of the PM.
- "Changing the rules of the game . . ."
- Have they really run out of time, or is it a timely end to the interview for Simon Walker. Given Muldoon’s wee smile he’d probably suggest the latter.
